Podcast Drop Date: 11/07/2024
In the latest episode of the Functional Medicine Foundations podcast, host Amber Warren sits down with Dr. Sam Petersen, known as The Boise Natural Dentist, for an in-depth discussion on biological dentistry and its essential role in holistic health. Dr. Petersen examines the impact of fluoride on systemic health, sharing insights from recent studies that question its safety. He also dives into the importance of the oral microbiome in supporting gut health, explaining how oral bacteria can influence digestion and potentially introduce harmful pathogens. Additionally, he highlights the effects of oral parasites and toxins on the body, reinforcing the concept that comprehensive healthcare must include attentive treatment of oral health.
Transcript:
Amber Warren, PA-C: Welcome to the Functional Medicine Foundations podcast, where we explore root cause medicine, engage in conversation with functional and integrative medicine experts, and build community with like minded health seekers. I'm your host, Amber Warren. Let's dig deeper. Hi, everyone. Welcome back. We're here with Doctor Sam Petersen, also known as The Boise Natural Dentist. He's an Idaho native who both he and his wife were raised in southeast Idaho. He is passionate about helping his patients achieve whole body health and wellness through biological dentistry and a holistic lifestyle. Doctor Petersen is a lifelong learner and continues to seek out the best continuing education courses available to make sure he is at the cutting edge of dentistry. He has a Doctorate in Dental Medicine and a Master's in Oral Biology. Welcome, Doctor Petersen.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah. Thank you.
Amber Warren, PA-C: We're so glad to have you here. Thank you for having. It's fun because you're also our neighbor.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah, we're just right around the corner.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Right around the corner. It's awesome. And the name of your practice is.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Bio Smiles.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Bio Smiles. We love having you here.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah. Thank you.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Awesome, wonderful. So, um, let's start with just defining. I think there's still a lot of people. Biological dentistry. Natural dentistry. Integrative dentistry. Yeah. You're in your field of biological dentistry. How is that different from what we understand as just a normal dentist?
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah. So I mean, when it really comes down to it is, you know, the way I like to explain it is I try to find cleaner methods, cleaner materials that are really going to help reduce systemic inflammation. Um, at the end of the day, it's still dentistry. Unfortunately, I still have to come at people with a needle. I still have to numb you up. We still remove teeth and do crowns and all that kind of stuff. Um, you know, but there's there's definitely some nuances to it. Um, and but that's, that's a huge part of it is we're just looking for materials and methods that are going to reduce systemic inflammation. A simple example of that would be, uh, BPA. Um, BPA is is a common ingredient in most dental filling material. Um, it's an endocrine disruptor. It can definitely cause some problems that way. And I use BPA free composite. Um, another one that is, you know, potentially controversial, but it's one where I am like the weird dentist that, you know, doesn't use or recommend fluoride.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Oh you just went there?
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah, I did. I'm going there. We're just going to go there. But it's it's that where, you know, I always joke that, you know, when they say that nine out of ten dentists approve this toothpaste, I'm the 10th guy saying, no, I don't like it.
Amber Warren, PA-C: You actually don't like it. You're going to pick it apart.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah. You know, so, um, so that's that's one of those examples. And then when it comes to, you know, extractions or different surgeries and stuff, you know, we really kind of try to go above and beyond by way of really decontaminating the socket, cleaning that out. We use things like platelet rich fibrin in our surgeries and stuff to really improve and optimize healing. Um, so there's there's a lot of different nuances to it, but that's kind of the easiest way that I find to explain it.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Yeah. Tell us a little bit. It's always so intriguing to hear about people's stories into this profession, into the more naturally minded profession. So what's your story?
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah, yeah. So, you know, I always feel like, um, you know, most people that I found anyways that find their way into the natural space, um, there was an event that kind of shook them out of their apathy. Right? Um, and for my story, it's no different. Um, and so for me, it was, um, my, my oldest daughter was about four years old when she was diagnosed with an autoimmune condition. And at the same time, that was about the time I was starting dental school. And so we were taking my daughter to the doctor and we're checking things out and it's like, well, you know, we don't know what causes it. We don't know how to treat it. You know, here's some, you know, steroid cream. Good luck. You know. So for a vitiligo. So, um, losing pigments or bodies, attacking the melanocytes in her skin. Um, and that was the answer. And I was like, wait, what? You know, that's that's that's a terrible answer.
Amber Warren, PA-C: You have nothing more to give me.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah. I'm like, that's it. Um, and so during dental school, I was on my commute and stuff. I was listening to tons of different audio books Audiobooks on gut health and autoimmune disease and stuff, and really trying to understand what in the world was going on. So I kind of had this, like, interesting education on the side of my traditional dental training, while I'm also going through kind of more of the functional autoimmune gut health story.
Amber Warren, PA-C: And questioning everything.
Dr. Sam Petersen: And questioning everything.
Amber Warren, PA-C: What a blessing you were going through your conventional training, questioning everything. Like, I almost wish in some aspects I could redo some of my training to where you could question everything.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah.
Amber Warren, PA-C: At least in your own mind.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah. Yeah. And there were and I had I had plenty of questions. And I've always been somebody who asked questions. And if the answer doesn't seem adequate or good enough, you know, then I keep digging until I get a satisfactory answer. Um, and so during dental school and stuff, it was the same thing when they're talking about, you know, I mean, they just hit it, hit it so hard and they had all the research right to back it. On how safe and effective. Um, you know, mercury amalgam fillings are and how great and how wonderful and all the things. Right? And yet when we got done placing a filling like that, we had to take the scraps and we had to double glove and like, you know, put those scraps into a container and put those containers into another container so that the EPA could come and pick them up and dispose of it. And it because it was illegal to put it down the sink.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Right.
Dr. Sam Petersen: And it's illegal to throw it in the garbage because it's toxic.
Amber Warren, PA-C: You're like, that was in someone's mouth.
Dr. Sam Petersen: But the only legal place for me to put it was actually inside somebody's body. And, you know, I'm just like, hey, I've got a I've got a question. You know.
Amber Warren, PA-C: You're not allowed to ask.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah. Well, you know.
Dr. Sam Petersen: You know, and so some of those questions, you know, they did get awkward, but, um, and I wasn't flippant about it and I wasn't trying to, like, argue. I was legitimately just trying to learn. Yeah. And trying to understand why that was okay. You know, and there's there's arguments for it and everything else. But at the end of the day, we have better materials. And that's an antiquated science that's, you know, they were invented in the 1830s by some French scientist. You know, I mean, it's two literally almost 200 years later.
Amber Warren, PA-C: It's not like you're going totally rogue.
Dr. Sam Petersen: And we've got better things now, guys, you know.
Amber Warren, PA-C: I have to ask, why do you think there's still so many conventional dentists not using the better materials? Why do you think that only some of you have asked the question? I got a double glove and protect myself from this stuff, but I can put in people's mouths.
Dr. Sam Petersen: I think a huge part, a huge part of the population does like has moved away from, from the mercury amalgam fillings. And frankly, I find that most of those are I mean, unfortunately, I mean, and almost criminally, it's, it's a they're they're almost limited to low income clinics, VA, Military Medicaid, and it's because.
Amber Warren, PA-C: The mercury fillings are so much cheaper.
Dr. Sam Petersen: They're so much cheaper. They're so much cheaper.
Amber Warren, PA-C: A lot of reasons. Right.
Dr. Sam Petersen: And so yes, because like the reimbursement that the insurances will pay for a mercury amalgam filling are so small. Yeah. Um, you know, so it's a, it's a cheap material. Yeah. Um, and I can't argue with the fact that they last a long time.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Right. They're durable.
Dr. Sam Petersen: They're incredibly durable. And they'll outlast my composites. My composites. I mean, when you when you go toe to toe with a metal versus a resin. The metals are going to be more durable. But aside from the fact they're, you know, up to 50% of them is laden with mercury. They're, you know, over time, they crack and break teeth and, and stuff. So aside from that, they're great.
Amber Warren, PA-C: So, so but yeah. No, I want to dig into that one. A lot of my patients will say, I don't know if I have mercury in my mouth. So how do people know if they have mercury fillings?
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah, I mean, that's a simple exam, you know, just actually just peeking in their mouth and seeing. We can see if they're cracked, if they're broken. Um, if they're causing those types of issues. A lot of times just the surface stain, you can see if they're leaking.
Amber Warren, PA-C: And the issue is they're leaking mercury into their bloodstream. Yeah. And it becomes systemic heavy metal toxicity.
Dr. Sam Petersen: So yeah. And again, you know, it's one of those things the research will argue. You know there's some of that that says that once it sets up you know, it doesn't leach anymore. But I've taken thousands of them out. And you always see how much it's really leached into the tooth and how much dark, you know, black staining has leached into the dentinal tubules. And, and there's a there's other research, too, that, you know, argues that it does leach into the system and can, you know, there's there's one that talked about retrograde axonal transport. So that's a fancy way of saying traveling backwards up the up the nerve where it would actually travel. They demonstrated this in mice where it would actually travel up the nerve, and then the mercury would actually deposit in the brain.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Mhm.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Um, that's that's of concern.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Yeah. Yeah.
Dr. Sam Petersen: To me.
Amber Warren, PA-C: For good reason for sure. Absolutely. Especially with Alzheimer's and dementia.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah, you know maybe.
Amber Warren, PA-C: And prediabetes, you know. Um, so when we're talking about and and this correct me if I'm wrong, but when I approach my patients because we're always looking at oral health, I talk about mercury amalgams, kind of like I do root canals. It's not necessarily that it might be an issue now. It's not necessarily an issue of, um, if it's when it becomes a problem is that it might not be an issue now, but at some point it will impact your health in your lifetime. So it's probably a good idea to take care of it now while you're younger.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah. And it's one of those things too, where like, it gets it gets tricky. It gets tricky because, um, like, as far as just, I guess I'm sidestepping a little bit here just with like, the, the legalese of it and stuff. So, um, one of the things I always go back to is it was in 2018, the American Dental Association updated their code of ethics. Okay. And in that update, they included an update that said that if a dentist recommends that you remove your mercury amalgam fillings just because there's mercury in them that's considered unethical overtreatment. Okay.
Amber Warren, PA-C: This is not that long ago. This is.
Dr. Sam Petersen: This is 2018. So, so, um, so it's one of those things, right? If if there's cracking, if there's breaking, if there's leaking, if there's obvious decay and stuff, then I can recommend that you take those out and we take them out under a safe amalgam removal protocol where we barrier the patient up from head to toe. We've got a rubber dam on. They've got, you know, a forced oxygen with a nasal cannula. And we've got a mercury grade filter that goes right in their mouth in front of their mouth to help pull the mercury vapor away from them and from me. You know, we wear disposable gowns and hairnets and no good mercury grade masks and all that to keep us safe. Right? But the fact is, is I can't I can't recommend that. It's like, oh, you have mercury fillings. You need to take those out. I can't say that.
Amber Warren, PA-C: So what do you say?
Dr. Sam Petersen: Well, yeah, I mean, I just I just let them know that it's the, you know, there's there's a potential issue right now. There is still there's still such a thing as a cosmetic procedure. Absolutely right. And that's the other funny thing about it. Right. It's unethical for me to take it out because there's a toxin in it. But if you don't like the way it looks, well, that's totally fine.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Yeah, then let's get it out, you know. Isn't that wild?
Dr. Sam Petersen: And so, so so that's kind of what, what it becomes is, is you have to if you want to, if you want to take it out for cosmetic reasons, we can do that.
Amber Warren, PA-C: We'll take it out.
Dr. Sam Petersen: You know.
Amber Warren, PA-C: And replace it with a nice pretty white.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Make it nice.
Amber Warren, PA-C: And pretty, you know. And so similar. Let's talk about some of the issues with root canals. One how do people know they have a root canal. That's a little bit harder to just look in the mouth and see.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah, correct. And so I mean one hopefully the patient.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Hopefully they know that.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Hopefully they know,sometimes they don't but sometimes they sometimes they have no idea. Yeah. Root canal. Um and you're right. They just I don't know, I just did what my dentist told me and he said I needed it. So this is what I got. Right. Um, so root canals are also another interesting animal. Um, and, you know, called me. Call me old fashioned, but I still believe in informed consent. Okay.
Amber Warren, PA-C: I love that. Great. You're so boring and conservative.
Dr. Sam Petersen: So so so when I. When I explain, you know, I'm very big on just explaining the risks and benefits of what root canals really are. And once the once the structure of the natural tooth has been compromised, anything we do after that is, is below. You know what God gave you in the first place? Right, right, right. Um, and so, so there's there's risks and benefits and limitations to everything we do after that, you know? And so, um, and it's one of those things too, I don't want to like, you know, I definitely want to, like, demonize anybody who still does root canals. I still feel like they have a place.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Do you?
Dr. Sam Petersen: I do.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Good.
Dr. Sam Petersen: I do. Um, and especially in kids and stuff. Right. And this may be weird for a biologic dentist to argue that some of my biologic counterparts might be like, hey, what is he talking about? But I still I still just feel like there's a time and place for for everything. And I try not to get too dogmatic about any of it. But with root canals, you know the real benefit. Right. And so this is me arguing for for them. Okay. The real benefit is kind of threefold. The first is that if a tooth was hurting, it gets you out of pain.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Right, that's true.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Okay. Um, it's a morbid statistic, but back in the 1800s, one of the leading causes of suicide was tooth pain.
Amber Warren, PA-C: No way.
Dr. Sam Petersen: So if it's between you getting a root canal and you like clocking out for good.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Because of chronic pain.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Because of acute pain, you know, then. Then, for crying out loud, get the root canal.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Right, that's a good point.
Dr. Sam Petersen: You know, that's a good point. Um, and sometimes we take that for granted in our modern world, right? Um, but it gets you out of pain. One of them is it, uh, helps preserve the bone. And this is one where a lot of people don't understand this. They're like, even in my world, they're like, I don't want the tooth. I want to get it out. It's like, well, you need to understand what's going to happen if you take that tooth out. Over time, the bone is going to atrophy because there's no longer a tooth working out the bone stuff. So a root canal actually helps preserve the bone. The other thing it does, it helps. It gives you something to function with and chew with and smile with. Right. And when we talk about whole health, sometimes we might forget about our psychosocial health and our ability to smile and how impactful that really can be. Um, you know, so those are the real big benefits. And they are they're they're worth considering, you know. Um, but, you know, on the on the downside, what root canals are, um, you know, at their, at their base level, root canals are sources of chronic inflammation, right? Period.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Um, because of why what's going on in a root canal that makes it a source?
Dr. Sam Petersen: Um, it's one of those things where, like, teeth. Teeth are, um, when they're alive, you know, there's there's they're porous. There's all these tiny little microtubules and channels and stuff where there's actually a lymphatic fluid, dental lymph that's pushing through the tooth and help detoxing it, keeping it clean. Um, and when a tooth dies, you lose that. And and you can, you can seal off the major channels with the root canal, and they are improving. But it's impossible for them to seal off every tiny little microscopic tube. Right? And those tubes are still big enough for microbes to get in. And so you end up with kind of a microbial laden sponge of a tooth that now every time you chew, you know, that that microbial laden sponge is being squished into the bone and there's microbes that are causing inflammation. Right. Um, one of the big ones, too, as far as cardiovascular health and some of the biomarkers that my functional folks pick up on is myeloperoxidase. And that's significantly inflammatory, especially when it comes to cardiovascular health. And that is, uh, almost always present in recurrent infections and root canal teeth.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Oh, my gosh, I had no idea.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah. So if you see, if you see an elevated biomarker of myeloperoxidase,
Amber Warren, PA-C: Very often
Dr. Sam Petersen: They need to be sent over for a cbct to make sure that they don't have a reinfected re-infected root canal tooth.
Amber Warren, PA-C: So not all root canals are bad. Some stay controlled and don't actually cause inflammation.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah, I would say that all of them cause inflammation. But it's one of those things like like I said, on their best day, even if it's not reinfected, it's still a source of chronic inflammation.
Amber Warren, PA-C: But they're not all acutely infected.
Dr. Sam Petersen: They're not all acutely infected. At some point. You know, they tend to go that way at some point, right. Um, you know, now there's always the anomaly out there. Um, you know, we say that there's there's somebody who can smoke two packs a day for 40 years and they don't get lung cancer, you know, and for whatever reason, their body is just really good at detoxing. Um, but. And then there's other people that, you know, having a root canal, it can really throw their body over the edge as far as what, what their threshold for inflammation is and what their body can handle.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Right. Yeah. You want to put out all those little fires. So I feel like we're always talking about this term gut microbiome, gut microbiome gut microbiome. And we don't enough talk about the oral microbiome.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah.
Amber Warren, PA-C: And the importance of it. So can you can you share some insight shed some insight on. Sure. The oral microbiome and why we should care.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah. Yeah. Definitely. Yeah. I mean, it's one of those things that, you know, the the tube is all connected.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Right.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Um, you know, so the.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Tube is all connected.
Dr. Sam Petersen: It's.
Amber Warren, PA-C: I love that I have never heard that. That's so great.
Dr. Sam Petersen: But that's that's what it is, right?
Amber Warren, PA-C: It's so true.
Dr. Sam Petersen: And every time we swallow, we are seeding our gut with billions and billions of microbes. Um, and so if there is a complete oral dysbiosis going on, um, it can, you know, really permeate the gut. It can permeate the bone, it can permeate the, the bloodstream and stuff. Right? I mean, if it's kind of like, uh, one of the fastest ways for people to absorb medication is by placing it under their tongue.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Absolutely.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Right. Well,
Amber Warren, PA-C: Sublingually.
Dr. Sam Petersen: You've got all these bacteria in your mouth as well that, I mean, that's their playground, too. And all that vasculature. Um, you know, they can they can burrow through and get through and, um, you know, right into our bloodstream and can cause, you know, issues elsewhere. Systemically. So when the mouth is off, um, there's a good chance that things are off elsewhere.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Elsewhere, yeah. So how what are some really easy ways at home people can help to balance the oral microbiome?
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah, I mean, honestly, really when you, when you get down to like the, the nitty gritty, the nuts and bolts of it all. Um, oral health and systemic health are the same.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Yeah I agree, so intricately connected.
Dr. Sam Petersen: They are 100% the same. And you know, sometimes it sometimes it can be one versus the other, where sometimes we'll see a dysbiosis in the mouth, we'll see cavities in the mouth. We'll see different issues in the mouth that are actually a symptom of other issues that are happening systemically. And you get that tweaked and dialed in and the issues in the mouth go away.
Amber Warren, PA-C: You're talking like malnutrition, poor nutrient levels, poor micronutrient levels.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Hormones.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Hormones.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Hormones can play a huge role in that, you know. Um, and so, I mean, that can be seen with, uh, I mean, the times when women are the most susceptible to oral health issues is going to be puberty, pregnancy and menopause. Yeah. You know, and and it has, but it's like, well, what am I doing? I've been doing everything right. I've still been flossing and brushing and I've still been doing. But now I have x, y, z problems and it's like, well it's it's not it's not here. Yeah. It's you have to look elsewhere. It's there. You've got you've got hormonal imbalances that are contributing to it.
Amber Warren, PA-C: But what's the mechanism there. Like in menopause I can assume it's like low antioxidant levels or being less insulin sensitive. But what's that mechanism in puberty and adolescence? Just an imbalance in the body, which.
Dr. Sam Petersen: A lot of it is estrogen and progesterone. Yeah. Um, you know, and without all my, like, notes and stuff, you know, I wouldn't be able to go into.
Amber Warren, PA-C: No, I can see that, though. Just like an estrogen dominant state, even like PCOS or issues like that. Okay. Yeah.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Makes a lot of sense. So so cool.
Dr. Sam Petersen: So sometimes, you know, it can it can definitely be sourced in the mouth, but sometimes there's issues elsewhere that are contributing to the mouth and vice versa. That's what I'm saying, where it's just inextricably connected. And if you get your whole health in order, your oral health is going to come in line and.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Vice versa, right? You get your oral microbiome in order. That's going to do wonderful things.
Dr. Sam Petersen: It's going to help. It's definitely yeah, it's definitely gonna help, especially if you are eliminating some of these chronic sources of inflammation. Right. If you're eliminating or ideally preventing right. Preventing your the need for a root canal. If you don't have big nasty cavities, you don't need root canals. And then you don't need implants and you don't need all of this other expensive stuff.
Amber Warren, PA-C: And then you save a lot of money.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah, you said ton of money. It's very expensive. Yeah. Um, you know, and and it's just kind of a funny place to be in because, like, I work every day trying to put myself out of business.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Yeah, I know you don't want to see your clients coming back.
Dr. Sam Petersen: You know, I want them to be healthy. I want them to, like, never have the issue again. That's true. Um, but but that's, you know, so so really what it comes down to is, is, you know, whole health, nutrition, nutrition, nutrition prevention. Mhm. Um, and and beyond that, every, everything else after that is uh it's a, it's a, it's a hack. It's a cheat. It's a, you know, band aid of sorts. But we can, we can help, we can mitigate and we can, we can do. But, um, you know, there's going to be limitations if the patient themselves aren't willing to change certain habits. And so what are those lifestyles.
Amber Warren, PA-C: As a dentist? What are those habits?
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah. Um, I mean, the biggest, biggest obvious, I feel like, is the biggest obvious elephant in the room is sugar.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Yeah.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Carbohydrates, processed foods. But. And sugar in all of its forms.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Right. The Goldfish crackers that turn to sugar.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah. Oh, my gosh.
Amber Warren, PA-C: They damage your teeth.
Dr. Sam Petersen: You know? Yeah. You know, and but it's just it's everywhere and it's pervasive. And we're about to kick off sugar season, right?
Amber Warren, PA-C: For sure.
Dr. Sam Petersen: It's coming. And so October 31st kicks off sugar season. And it's no longer just Halloween. Right.
Amber Warren, PA-C: But it's not even the 31st. It's the parties and the events that start happening three weeks before Halloween starts.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Right before it and then and then and then after that, we've got Thanksgiving. And it's not Thanksgiving without all the pie. And then it's Christmas. And now, now it's like it extends beyond that. Now everybody gets treats and stuff for like Valentine's and Saint Patrick's Day. It's like half the year, you know, and then and then Easter, you know. So we've got six months of sugar season. Um, and and it's just devastating. It's devastating to to whole health. And it's, it's completely devastating to the oral microbiome of the mouth and, you know, to your oral health.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Yeah. So cut sugar, cut processed foods, eat real food that comes from the ground.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Eat,real food that comes from the ground. And and, I mean, I can't emphasize the, the healthy proteins and stuff enough as well. And that's one of the things that's interesting too, um, is when it comes to actually like people talk a lot about remineralization. And even in the holistic world now, it's like the hydroxyapatite and it's still applying something external to the tooth in hopes that it's going to remineralize it. And there's a there's a benefit, but the vast majority of remineralization happens from the inside.
Amber Warren, PA-C: So you're talking root cause.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah. Well, and what's interesting is how teeth remineralize. Right. They have to have the mineral from your diet. They have to be able to absorb it. But then there's actually a cell. And this gets into the nerdy science for a second. But there's a cell called an odontoblast. And that's what lays down the dentin. And your body is built to repair the dentin from time to time, just like other cells. It gets old and it wears out and stuff. And so your your body differentiates these cells and sends them out to make new, uh, dentin. And first they have to lay down a collagen matrix right before they start applying mineral to it. Um, but in order to form the collagen matrix, they need protein. They need protein.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Amino acids. Those are the building blocks of all cells.
Dr. Sam Petersen: And but I see it, I see it, and I've I catch flack for this from time to time. But it's one of those things where I do, I see in diets who are strictly vegetarian, strictly vegan, you know, some of the Ayurvedic types where there's there's benefit. There's there's good things in all of those diets. Um, but but the lack of healthy fats and proteins, um, man, it sure impacts oral health in a big way. And sometimes it's not seen immediately. I feel like, you know, most of the times it's patients who have who have lived that lifestyle for, you know, upwards of 10 to 11 years. And after that.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Then it starts to show up.
Dr. Sam Petersen: I see a ton of cavities, I see a ton of cavities. And they're like, well, I eat clean, I'm eating clean, and maybe you are, but you're not giving your body what it needs to rebuild itself.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Or maybe there's a gut microbiome issue malabsorption issue.
Dr. Sam Petersen: There certainly could be.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Where you're not absorbing fats or proteins like you should because of. I mean, so many of our guts are so disturbed.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah.
Amber Warren, PA-C: There's. Yeah. Yeah.
Dr. Sam Petersen: 100%. Because that's that's one of those other big multifaceted issues. Right. Where if your body. If your teeth aren't getting enough mineral, it's either not there in the diet or it's in the diet, but you're not absorbing it.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Are you doing any like mineral testing, micronutrient testing in your clinic to look at some of the building blocks that you need for?
Dr. Sam Petersen: Not yet. No. And it's one of those things too, where it does get tricky. And I mean, this is where I need to have important relationships with folks like you, because.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Totally.
Dr. Sam Petersen: At the same time, I got to stay in my lane, you know, even though it is my lane, because we're talking about the oral health and stuff. But, um, you know, but some of that, it starts to blur.
Amber Warren, PA-C: The lines can get a little blurry. I could see that.
Dr. Sam Petersen: When you determine that oral health and systemic health are the same thing, then yeah, the lines can get blurred, but I still I still need to, you know, try and stay in my lane. And then that's why forming relationships with.
Amber Warren, PA-C: It's so important. Yeah. All of us practitioners we have to just always keep in good communication and stay in touch. And yeah, I just so value being able to send patients literally around the street to go see you for because yeah, I'm hands off on all that stuff. Like go see my friend Doctor Petersen.
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Amber Warren, PA-C: So fluoride. We have to touch on fluoride because I feel like it's in. At least I see it. Social media and in some of our discussions, presentations, conferences we attend. There's a lot of talk on fluoride right now. So what's the concern? Why should parents and adults alike be aware?
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah. And again this is one of those things where it's it's been controversial from the beginning.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Yeah.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Um, and some people don't know that.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Yeah.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Some people even like in my world. Right. My, my dental companions, you know, they, um, it's. Well, the dental school has taught us and here's the research, and it's great and it's good and it's wonderful, and it's the best thing ever. Right. It's still hailed as the, the, the biggest achievement in oral health in the 21st century. Right. Yeah, yeah, 100%. Um, and yet some, some of my counterparts don't know or haven't bothered to look at some of the controversy from its inception, um, which is also very interesting, but it's, um, it was largely water fluoridation started with the, um, kind of the it was kind of during the war effort and stuff where there was the DuPonts and, and the big chemical companies of the time were they had a bunch of toxic waste products and fluoride was, was in that. And it was very difficult and very expensive for them to get rid of it. Um, and there was some town that they found that was like, you know, they had a higher level of fluoride in their water, and they saw that they had a lower level of cavities, and they were like, okay, here we go. Right. Well, they literally hired the author. Have you heard of the book Propaganda?
Amber Warren, PA-C: Yes.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Okay. So it's considered one of the most 100 influential books of the last century. Um, and but they literally hired the author of the book Propaganda, Edward Bernays, to come in and spearhead the marketing effort to get the American people to accept it as a good thing, because even back then, they were very concerned that it was not going to be healthy. Right. Um, And it's also very telling to go back and look at the old fluoride commercials and to hear the verbiage that they use.
Amber Warren, PA-C: And what year is this again?
Dr. Sam Petersen: This is like in the 1940s.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Okay. 1940s. Okay. So like World War Two, you said that. You said that the war.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah. You know, so so the but the the verbiage on the commercials, you want to know what they said? You could probably guess it. It's very safe and effective.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Of course.
Dr. Sam Petersen: It's very safe and effective.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Like what they call Roundup right now.
Dr. Sam Petersen: You know but but that's that was that was it's still it's still, uh, what's what's utilized in their campaigns to this day that it's very safe and effective. Um, and fluoride, it's, it's aside from it being a known neurotoxin. Um, I mean, there was just another I mean, there's been studies like this coming out for, for the last 20 years that, um, significant, statistically significant differences in IQ levels in children who have, you know, consumed fluoride. But it's like, oh, well, it's, you know, it's at higher amounts or that's not an American study. So it doesn't count, you know. Or whatever things we use to justify it. Right. Um, but just a few weeks ago, just a few weeks ago, there was a big meta analysis published in the United States showing a statistically significant difference between IQ levels in children. Right. I mean, this is the difference between it could honestly be the difference between your kid being an engineer and your kid being a janitor. Um, and it's like, okay, well, great. Well, the janitor has less cavities, but it's like, well, yeah, okay. But like, would you, would you risk. Would you risk a couple cavities.
Amber Warren, PA-C: For your brain?
Dr. Sam Petersen: For a life that could be completely different? You know, I mean, it's it's to me that's just kind of insane.
Amber Warren, PA-C: So who's. I just I have so many questions. Who's benefits? These are things I've never thought of honestly, with regards to fluoride. Who's benefiting like big pharma? I go no further. We know who benefits there. You can follow the money, but like, who's benefiting from fluoride.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah,
Amber Warren, PA-C: Is there a significant markup there.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Like there is. And that's that's another thing where it's potentially awkward and could get people mad at me. But, um, but it's one of those things where like, uh, you know, I know for, for some dentists, just, just the fluoride applications. Right. You come in and, oh, you get your topical fluoride application and stuff, and it's 25 bucks and your insurance covers it. It's no fee to you or whatever, right?
Amber Warren, PA-C: Well, and it takes 30 seconds. So $25 takes 30s.
Dr. Sam Petersen: And it's like, yeah, I mean, it's it builds out at whatever it is, 25, 50, 75 bucks a pop, you know. Um, and so it certainly can impact a dentist's bottom line.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Okay.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Um, for sure. And stuff. So. And nobody likes the status quo disrupted. Um.
Amber Warren, PA-C: So that is a good point. That is a good point. You still have a business to run, and you're you're going to upset that because it's a.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah, I mean, all of a sudden you pull the plug on that and it's been.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Around for 100 years.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah. You know, and and it's the same thing where the vast majority of people are still using it, recommending it. And so still, at this moment in time, you know, you're you're the odd duck for, for going, you know, upstream. But um, but I'm telling you, the tide is shifting.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Yeah, I agree.
Dr. Sam Petersen: In a big way. And even this there was a federal judge shortly after that meta analysis was published. There's been this long fight with with fluoride going on over the last year and a legal battle. Um, and the there was a federal judge just a couple of weeks ago that ruled that the EPA needs to change what they consider to be safe and effective doses, because at their current levels, they are proving to be toxic and.
Amber Warren, PA-C: But current levels and safe and effective used in dental offices. What about like what's in our drinking water?
Dr. Sam Petersen: That's what I'm talking about. I'm actually talking about the drinking water.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Okay, you're talking about drinking water.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah. Okay.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Yeah. Yeah. Okay. You know, so are you recommending people get, like, reverse osmosis filters, whole house filtration?
Dr. Sam Petersen: And I still I recommend the reverse osmosis, I. But but that can actually cause the water to be a bit more acidic.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Right.
Dr. Sam Petersen: And stuff. And so adding trace minerals back into the water so that it brings the pH back up and doesn't strip everything of the minerals. Um, so that's definitely the better way to go.
Amber Warren, PA-C: What kind of remineralization do you like? Like are you is there a brand you like, or how are you doing that?
Dr. Sam Petersen: No, I mean, I guess I don't have a brand at the moment, but a good trace mineral and stuff, and.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Any good generic trace mineral, I would agree.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Um, but but that to me is a better source of of viable drinking water.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Okay, I'm so curious to share with our audience and our community what are some of the cool. I know you do a lot of really cool testing in your clinic that you definitely would never see if you walk into a conventional. So what can people, what can people expect if they were to go into your clinic for just a generic checkup cleaning?
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah. Yeah. So, so, yeah, with our new patient exams, um, you know, really starting in January, there's, there's a number of things that will be slightly different than what we've been doing, and some of them remain the same. But the biggest things is one, we're going to be doing Cone Beam CTS on everybody and stuff so that.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Oh my gosh, I actually love that.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah, because because we've been there. We missed too many silent infections, too many little hidden root canal infections, things like that. So we're going to be taking CTS on everybody. In addition to that, we're going to be doing biocompatibility testing on every new patient.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Okay. Tell our clients or tell our listeners what that is.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah. So I mean, biocompatibility is incredibly important just because we need to make sure that what we're putting in your mouth is something that your body is going to agree with. Sometimes people might have a tooth that goes hot after it being worked on. It's sensitive and it wasn't close to the nerve, and we got all the decay out and all that stuff, but the tooth is still causing a lot of pain. They could be having an allergic reaction.
Amber Warren, PA-C: How interesting.
Dr. Sam Petersen: And if you take that tooth or that material out and swap it out with a different one.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Calms down.
Dr. Sam Petersen: The tooth can calm down. So we're actually going to be doing biocompatibility testing on every one of our patients. Um, and that will take the form of either blood testing for some folks, um, and others, um, it will be through bioresonance scanning, um, which is, which is very interesting. Um, and then two other tests that we do is, is we are doing oral DNA testing on everybody through Bristol Health. Um, and so the, you know, we'll get a real look at the oral microbiome, the ratios as far as what's there, what's present. Um, and so we can really tweak our recommendations beyond that.
Amber Warren, PA-C: So you're looking kind of like what we do in the gut, a low sense of the good beneficial bacteria, but also too much of a bad thing.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Correct.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Whether it be bacteria, funguses, viruses, parasites, I would assume.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah, so with the parasites. Yeah. So the Bristol Health I know they don't cover parasites yet, but I've been pushing them to cover it.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Cool.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Um, and then we screen for, um, we see parasites and stuff on our, on our microscope slides. So that's the other thing we utilize is phase contrast microscopy. And we take samples from underneath people's gums. And we put it on a slide and we're able to see it in real time. And we can see the bacteria moving around. And we can see oftentimes we see little parasites that are also causing problems in the gums. And so we're able to, you know, address that as well, which.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Cause you treat it right there in your clinic.
Dr. Sam Petersen: So we have some treatments. Yeah. So we have some some modalities to treat it locally in the mouth. But again if we're seeing, you know, a lot of the most common are amoebas and stuff. And if we're seeing a lot of that in the mouth, well, then actually talking about potentially doing some systemic parasite cleansing and stuff, you know, is definitely in the conversation. And some people, they're well versed in it and they're like, oh, yeah, I figured I'm on it. Yeah. And they're like, I got this. I've been through a million of them. I'm on it. And other people, they're like, hey, this is new to me. And I'm like, go see my friend Amber. Yeah. You know, because I'm like, I'm not, I'm not going to quarterback a full systemic parasite cleanse.
Amber Warren, PA-C: You don't need people calling you on the weekends that are having diarrhea or reactions to, you know, the first step of the parasite cleansing. You don't want that. Yeah. Well, a lot of people can't just get thrown into a parasite cleanse. And that's some of my worry too, is that people start, you know, there's so much knowledge available at our fingertips, fingertips. And I have friends sending me, you know, social media influencers all the time that try to parasite cleanse or try this and have this amazing response. And I'm like, you're you have to start at ground zero.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Right.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Is your lymphatic system working? Is your gut working? Are you are you constipated?
Dr. Sam Petersen: Are you healthy enough? Two planes.
Amber Warren, PA-C: What is your level of health? Inflammation. Your ability to detox before you try and rid your body of something that doesn't belong there? Like you have to start with step one, or else you're going to make yourself really sick and you could do more harm than good if you're trying to work through this on your own. So yeah, it does become a little a little, um, touch and go there.
Dr. Sam Petersen: You know, one of the things too, that I think is worth noting is from from my understanding and from what everything I've read to this point, um, some of those, I mean, and I would assume it's the same in your world that parasites, uh, at least in the mouth, are generally a secondary infection.
Amber Warren, PA-C: For sure. It's hardly ever root cause. Yeah. And if you don't clean the gut after you do the parasite cleanse, you're going to end up right back where you were three months later.
Dr. Sam Petersen: And so it's it's really to get back to the diet and that where it's like the carbohydrates are feeding the bad bacteria that produce acids. And those acids damage the tissue. And that damaged tissue is then eaten by Candida and parasites. Um, and so they're really the cleanup crew.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Yeah.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Um, that come in.
Amber Warren, PA-C: A really good way to put it.
Dr. Sam Petersen: And, and and but if there's too much dead tissue, right, then they're going to proliferate and they're going to set up shop, and then they start causing their own level of issues and toxicity. And so some of sometimes I feel like it's like, oh, look like, you know, this is crazy. Look at this. We got to kill the parasite.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Yeah, you focus so much on that. Yeah.
Dr. Sam Petersen: But if we don't address what caused the environment to be a, you know, to be a good host for the for the parasites themselves. Right. We got to back up another notch and address, you know, I always kind of go back to like a soil example where it's like where you've got weeds growing, you know, and it's like, what made this soil a good, good landing ground for, for those types of seeds versus really cultivating the soil and making it a good place for.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Right.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Good healthy.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Always coming back to food to grow.
Dr. Sam Petersen: You know.
Amber Warren, PA-C: And I would assume that within within the mouth and oral health, it's so similar to the body that the fight and flight, the nervous system, like your cells can't heal. You're not sleeping. I mean, are you talking about the life cycle of a not dendrite?
Dr. Sam Petersen: That's the odontoblasts.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Odontoblasts like, I'm just thinking, like, all the things we need for our cells to heal and regenerate and repair and for the senescent cells to get killed off and die. Like it's the same thing in the mouth as it is the rest of the body. Right? You have to sleep. You have to feed it well, fuel it well, you have to calm down. You have to get away from the blue light and go get some natural light. And yeah, it really is all the same. And it just all comes back to balance.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah.
Amber Warren, PA-C: When the body is not in a state of balance, no part of that body is happy, right?
Dr. Sam Petersen: Right. And when the body is out of balance, that's oftentimes teeth are a canary in the coal mine that are letting us know that something is out of balance elsewhere.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Yeah. Oh, it's so good. So gold. Anything else you want to share with our listeners? Just what you guys are offering, what you're doing? Because I really I feel strongly that you're disrupting you and in a small, small handful of others in this valley are really disrupting what we think of as conventional dental care. And I'm so thankful. Anything else you're doing in your clinic or anything else that's to come, or you're learning that you really feel like can bring value? Yeah.
Dr. Sam Petersen: I mean, so some some of the other stuff, there's a few things that are coming. I'm actually in the middle of developing my own tooth powder and my own toothpaste. So that's actually coming. Um,
Amber Warren, PA-C: Okay, send us some samples!
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah I will.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Um, that's so exciting.
Dr. Sam Petersen: So that's in the works. Um, which which will be great when that comes out. There's some some work that I'm, I'm some of it. It's a little bit under wraps, I guess, but I'm kind of working with, you know, some some ends on the nutrition side to make sure we've got some good.
Amber Warren, PA-C: I actually that crossed my mind when you're talking, I'm like, gosh, Doctor Petersen, to have a nutritionist nutritionist in house so your clients can get the help they need because, I mean, we have we do cash pay services here and we have insurance, but we're booked out. And it like, you know, so for you to have that we're really trying to change habits and, and educate people for you to have somebody in house that can educate your clients, that's huge, huge, huge.
Dr. Sam Petersen: So that's a that's a big piece that I'm working on. Um, and you know, so so that's coming and then and part of the product team up and stuff is also with another microbiologist that I'm been working with. So there's a number of things in the, in the pipeline and stuff. But um, but yeah, but otherwise like I said, we're looking for oral causes to systemic inflammation and trying to calm things down. Um, but we try to do the best we can with what we got and what knowledge we have. We're constantly trying to learn and get better at what we do. Um, but yeah, anybody listening out there, we'd love to have you as a patient.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Yeah Bio Smiles and I love you share some really good tips and tricks on your Instagram and social media, and your team does a great job with your social media too. So is it just bio? What's your social media?
Dr. Sam Petersen: It's the Boise Natural Dentist.
Amber Warren, PA-C: That's right. Boise Natural Dentist. Yeah. Cool. So, yeah. Go. Follow. Go follow. Doctor Petersen. He does some really good stuff. Thank you for this discussion. This is so valuable. You're such a valuable, um, colleague and partner to have in this community of just naturally minded individuals to help people on their journey. So I appreciate you.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Yeah, I appreciate you, Amber.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Thank you.
Dr. Sam Petersen: Thanks for having me.
Amber Warren, PA-C: Thank you for listening to the Functional Medicine Foundations podcast. For more information on topics covered today, specialties available at the FMI Center for Optimal Health, and the highest quality of supplements and more go to funmedfoundations.com.
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